Hair

Viking, Saxon, and Early Christian Irish cultures

Moderator: the_power

Hair

Postby Fionnuala on Sun Sep 06, 2009 12:37 am

Not talking about the cool musical, but the actual stuff on my head... I have alot of it.

My friend and I were discussing hair styles and head coverings. Her persona is English.. I think about 14th century. My persona is more around the late 1100s and Irish. I've read somewhere a description of an early Irish woman whos hair was loose and flowing. I've read in another source that hair was often uncovered, but styled. Then there is the 'normal' period head coverings and the many period reasons for doing so.

My friend suggests that my hair would have been covered since it is after christianity arrived and the expectation of covering your head (for a woman) came with it. (I should mention that my persona is also married, but travels and makes her way as a lower-class bard in search of news regarding her husband who hasn't returned since joining the effort against the Norman invasion. My persona's excuse for being unattached and a 'bard'. ;) ) My rebuttal to her argument is that although christianity was predominate at that time, Irish woman were not as controlled by their men as the English women were. I've read that Irish women could hold office, own land, and basically still have opinions back in the day. I have also surmised that many (not all) Irish ways of life were maintained during this particular time in history, regardless of who thought they ruled them.

After all of that explanation, my question to you all is if you have any opinions on hairstyles during the early middle ages in Ireland. I prefer to leave my hair long or braided, but would like to be accurate my portrayal of an Irish woman in that time period.

thanks!
~ fionnuala
Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
User avatar
Fionnuala
Full Name: Fionnuala
 
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 1:10 am
Location: Michigan, US
Karma: 5

Re: Hair

Postby brendan on Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:27 am

thats quite a lot of stuff..
I don't have a lot of verifiable information on whether Irish women did or did not cover their hair around 1100-1200. http://www.amazon.com/Viking-Headcoverings-Dublin-Medieval-Excavations/dp/0954385551 has evidence from the Viking era but not sure how long this extended afterwards.

As a female bard or 'Cainnte' <sp?> you would have been in a fairly precarious situation - the legal system actively targeted female 'bards'. For details on that and all other aspects of the rights and obligations of women under Irish law in the time period in question have a look at http://books.dias.ie/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_25&products_id=149 this and the companion book on Early Irish Farming are 'Must Read' books. Details on stuff such as the 9 forms of marriage, divorce and land ownership are all there.

Of course that still doesnt really answer your question on hair coverings...

Brendan
User avatar
brendan
Active Newbie
Full Name: Brendan Griffin
 
Posts: 711
Joined: Sun Nov 16, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Nomadic
Karma: 66

Re: Hair

Postby the_power on Sun Sep 06, 2009 9:04 am

Certainly one of the more prevalent myths about Irish history is that women were 'less controlled' than other countries in Europe. Perhaps 'differently' controlled. It's specified in different ways that a woman "has three owners; her father in youth, her husband in middle age, and her sons in old age". Only women without a father, usband or sons-of-age could own land in her own right. When a woman married, she was given a dowry to bring into the marriage, which would often include 'clann land'. If her husband died, she would inherit the land - but she didn't own it. When she died, it would all revert to the family.

Irish attitude to women was closer to that of the 19thC Afghans; crazy laws like "it's not rape if the woman didn't cry out" and "it's not illegal to rape an unaccompanied woman in an ale-house" give some idea of the protections for common women. It was also legal to kidnap a woman for marriage (though this was seen as a 'lower' form of marriage. Women usually weren't allowed to make contracts, give surety and their word wasn't worth anything in court (unless around 'womanly' matters of fertility etc.).

Sorry to screw things up, but I'm pretty sure there would be no way a woman could act as a professional bard, never mind independantly. As Brendan said, the word used was "Cainnte", which pretty much means a professional gossip; someone who spreads tales on people. That said, it could be a lot of fun to play such a woman of ill-repute - not controlled by any man, seen to be a seditious element in society. The modern version of the crazy cat lady...

In Craggaunowen last year, we did a small piece on Brehon law & trial-by-combat, adjudicated by a lawyer. At the end, a Cainnte turns up and started slandering bawling the lawyer out of it, pointing out that his demand for payment vastly exceeded his qualifications, saying how he'd trained in a minor law school. It was as hilarious as it was informative. I think in the end, the lawyer charged the cainnte an 'illegal satirist' and called on nearby men to restrain and silence her. I wish we'ed gotten it on film :(

John
User avatar
the_power
Active Newbie
Full Name: John Looney
 
Posts: 508
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2003 11:00 pm
Location: Dublin 13, Ireland
Karma: 17

Re: Hair

Postby the_power on Sun Sep 06, 2009 9:08 am

Oh, on hair... we had a big discussion on this. Apparently there was a difference between Irish & English hairstyles in the 12th century; English women tended to try cover all their hair. Irish women wore headcoverings that were shorter, covering the the top & back of the head, but tresses falling out the back were OK. I think it's discussed in http://www.amazon.com/Viking-Headcoveri ... 0954385551

But yes, if you are playing a Christian, cover hair!

John
User avatar
the_power
Active Newbie
Full Name: John Looney
 
Posts: 508
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2003 11:00 pm
Location: Dublin 13, Ireland
Karma: 17

Re: Hair

Postby Fionnuala on Sun Sep 06, 2009 2:28 pm

Thank you both!!
No need to apologize as nothing is 'screwed up'. This just means I have more research to do. You have just proven to me that it was a great idea to join this forum. My persona's backstory is still a work in progress. Thank you for pointing me in the right direction.

"woman of ill-repute"... yes that could be fun. :lol:

You gentlemen are gems.
~ fionnuala
Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
User avatar
Fionnuala
Full Name: Fionnuala
 
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 1:10 am
Location: Michigan, US
Karma: 5

Re: Hair

Postby noodle on Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:14 pm

From about the tenth or eleventh century*, a Christian man could be excommunicated if his wife did not cover her hair. Thought that might be of interest ;)
Head in the clouds, feet in the grass, mind in the gutter...
noodle
Full Name: Niamh Carey
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:14 am
Location: Laois
Karma: 13

Re: Hair

Postby finnobreanan on Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:55 am

Fion,

I would really recommend getting a copy of Mairead Dunlevy's book, "Dress in Ireland".
http://www.amazon.com/Dress-Ireland-Mai ... 485&sr=1-1

It has some of the few documented images of women's clothing (and hair styles), in this book, and some with long locks like yourself, so no problem.

Lucase de Heere was the artist, and his images are probably Spot On.
http://www.britishmuseum.org/pdf/1-Gaud ... 0Truth.pdf
Finn O'Breanan
Wood Kerne

"...The O'Brennans, a sept of thieves without any right or title, ... were a perpetual disturbance to the peace of the county,"
User avatar
finnobreanan
Active Newbie
Full Name: Scott Cross
 
Posts: 439
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:00 am
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Karma: 14

Re: Hair

Postby Fionnuala on Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:53 pm

Noodle,
That is interesting. I didn't realize it was that early. I originally wasn't intending my persona to be christian, but as you can see, I need to rethink my persona anyway. lol. Thanks for the info.

Finn,
Thank you once again for the information. Your willingness to provide information is an invaluable asset to my quest.

:)
~ fionnuala
Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
User avatar
Fionnuala
Full Name: Fionnuala
 
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 1:10 am
Location: Michigan, US
Karma: 5


Return to Early-Medieval

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

cron
[phpBB Debug] PHP Notice: in file Unknown on line 0: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent